Analist Follies

Bill Weintraub

Bill Weintraub

Analist Follies


Last night an analist appeared on this board, and, clearly upset at encountering men who don't buy into his anal bullshit, submitted (under a phony email address) a series of what he appeared to believe were trenchant criticisms of Frot:

1. Men are into frottage because they weren't close to their fathers.

2. Frottage isn't real sex, it's a recreational activity.

3. One can't have a long-term relationship based upon a recreational activity.

What's interesting is how close these statements are to the sorts of statements made by straight people about *all* gay men in the 1950s, 60s, and 70s:

1. Men are gay because they weren't close to their fathers.

Reality: There doesn't seem to be any relationship between family structure and same-sex erotic interests. For example, both my late lover, Brett, and my current love, Patrick, were very close to their fathers, who were strong, masculine men.

2. Sex between men isn't real sex. Only reproductive, male-female, sex is real.

Reality: If one defines sex as activity leading only to reproduction, most sexual activity between human beings isn't sex. Clearly, not a very useful definition. Interestingly, however, if one defines sex as genital-genital contact, frot, like penile-vaginal intercourse, is sex; anal penetration isn't. Because the anus isn't a vagina or in any other way a sexual organ.

3. Homosexuals are incapable of long-term relationships.

Reality: Like nongay people, gay men and women have long-lasting relationships. Indeed, the cornerstone of this site is my detailed description of the very passionate and committed relationship I had with my late lover, in which anal played no part and cockrub was our core sexual act.

So: One reason I insist upon a cultural analysis of the prevalence of anal penetration among gay men are the ideational and emotional similarities between heterosexists of yesteryear and analists today.

Both groups, outwardly smug and complacent, are easily flustered and use similarly goofy and inadequate arguments to buttress, as it were, their positions of imagined superiority.

What no analist has been able, on this board or anywhere else, to counter are the following criticisms of anal penetration:

1. Anal penetration is dirty because it involves contact with feces.

2. Anal penetration is dangerous because it's the chief vector for four potentially fatal STDs and a host of others.

3. Anal penetration is demeaning because it turns the individual being penetrated into a pseudo-woman.

4. Anal penetration is not genital-genital sex. The anus is not a vagina, it's not capable of producing genital pleasure, and it was not designed to be penetrated and repeatedly rammed.

5. Anal penetration is not full-body, and pleasure is therefore greatly restricted.

Frot, on the other hand, is clean, equal, safe, masculine, full-body genital-genital sex, and there's no better sex on the planet.

If you're an analist and have a coherent response to those propositions, I'd like to hear it.

Otherwise, stay off our board.



Re: Analist Follies


Just to throw in my own two cents into this posting

1) You almost can not win with the statement. If you say you were not close to your father, you were repressed and if you say you were close to your father, that makes you homosexual and wanting to do it with your father. Personally, I was semi close to my father. He was a busy man but always made time to hang with me.

2) Fact: Aside from dolphins, humans are the only other currently known creatures to have sex for pleassure and not just reproduction. But ask a leading scientist what the dolphins are doing and no matter what the circumstances, they will say they are having sex. hmmm.....maybe we should just call ourselves dolphins..I am a Pisces HEHEHEHEH

3) Looking at the number of divorces by husbands and wives in the western hemisphere in the last year, I would say this statement is pure BONK. The fact is that today it is hard for anyone to survive living alone. Alot of people are getting married for sheer convienience, not love. (I know most of my friends did that) and most of them end in divorce. Meanwhile guys who are into frottage are looking for love. REAL LOVE. I guess that makes us the oddballs.

As to the rest of the post. I agree 153%. The anus was not meant to be penetrated. It is not a sexual organ. And severe damage can be done by anal sex. I personally still can not understand why anyone would want to do this to begin with.

Bill Weintraub

Re: Analist Follies


thanks jess

in the various essays located in the Frot: The Next Sexual Revolution section of the site, I talk about why anal sex became so prevalent among gay men, and i encourage site visitors to spend some time with those essays

basically, anal sex enables gay men to mimic heterosexuality, and heterosexuality is the primary model for sexuality in our society

so while in the last five years we've seen more tolerance of homosexuals as individuals, society itself remains overwhelmingly heterosexual, and virtually all models of sexuality are heterosexual -- or, in the case of gay men, mimic heterosexuality

what we're offering on this site is a model of homosex which does *not* mimic heterosex -- rather it's an act which is uniquely male

and that's perhaps part of the reason that straight-identified guys are attracted to cock2cock

but i don't want to overstate that

the straight guys on this site, like the gay guys, have had cock2cock fantasies and desires since at least puberty, and usually before

and that's why we describe frot as natural -- it's not a learned behavior, nor is it an acquired taste

rather frot is something which guys imagine and discover on their own, totally independent of societal and subcultural expectations

and to which they remain emotionally loyal despite great and sometimes terrible pressure to conform


Re: Analist Follies


I think that there is a stereotype model that homosexual sex has to have something to do with dominance/submission.

Therefore, frot is unique in that it can dispense with d./s.

And it is also an activity that is found among heterosexual males.

So my question is:

Why is frot found among only some males and not others? Could it be a form of ultra-masculinity? If it is nature rather than nurture induced, then is frot determined by one's genes?

Bill Weintraub

Re: Analist Follies


this reply is for the individual who submitted the post above, among a number of others which i did not approve

first of all, if you want to post, you must have a valid email address so that i can contact you

if you're using a shared computer, you can get a web-based email account on yahoo, which other users will not be able to access, and you can email me using that account

posting under an invalid email account is cowardly -- and it's beyond me why you think i should reward your cowardice by approving your posts

secondly, your posts have not been approved because it's the thrust of all of them, including this one, to treat frot as an oddity

that's an analist position, and if you want to espouse it, go to an analist site

because it's not going to appear here, except under conditions of my choosing, which i promise you will not be to your liking

thirdly, your posts indicate very clearly that you haven't read the articles and life stories which make up the core of the site

that's lazy -- before you can critique frot, if that's what you want to do, you have to understand it -- and you're simply not making a good faith effort to do that

now, who said "frot is found among only some males and not others"?

no one on this site

what we've said is that frot is considered junior league by many gay men, who've been *taught* that sex isn't real if it doesn't culminate in anal penetration

but frot can be "found" in virtually all men -- it's a natural, genital-to-genital act which all men are hardwired to enjoy

so what's the problem?

among gay men, frot is denigrated by the dominant culture of anal sex

a culture, to repeat, which says that if sex isn't anal-penetrative, it's not really gay

and among straight men, any same-sex contact is denigrated -- by the dominant heterosexual culture

so the reason frot is not more common among men in both groups is cultural, not genetic

left to their own inborn and on-board devices, men will rub cocks

it's a natural male activity -- you don't need to explain it

and you don't have to waste time on questions of ultra-infra or uber- unter

frot is just men being men, guys being guys

the same is not true of anal -- anal penetration is not a spontaneous or natural activity -- rather it's learned

teens and young men have to be initiated into and coached through anal -- and the behavior has to then be reinforced by repeated and incessant cultural messages about the desirability of anal

that's a very great and significant difference between the two acts

finally, frot, like anything sexual, is optional

if you're a man who's conflicted about same-sex intimacy, you don't have to act on your impulses

trust me on this -- whether you do so or not is, ultimately, of no interest to anyone but yourself

but if you do act on them, it makes a world of difference whether you choose frot or anal

one's dangerous, the other's safe

one degrades, the other ennobles

those are your choices

are we proselytizing?

you bet we are

and that's the real story here

for 25 years men into frot have been assaulted by a seemingly endless stream of pro-anal propaganda

which, in the name of being "gay," has pressured and coerced us to be penetrated -- when we don't like it and have no interest in it and know it's dangerous to boot

so we're fighting back -- we're saying anal stinks -- literally and figuratively

and we'll have no part of it

and we're reaching out to nongay men, more and more of whom are acknowledging their bisexuality, and saying

there's a way to be intimate with another man that's masculine, moral, healthy, and safe

that's what frot is -- and you should be ashamed of your puny attempts to marginalize it

because if you cared about yourself, your community, and other men, you would be celebrating frot and spreading the good news about it everywhere



Re: Analist Follies


Re: Analist Follies YOU GO BILL!!!!!

Add a reply to this discussion

Back to Personal Stories


Warriors Speak is presented by The Man2Man Alliance, an organization of men into Frot

To learn more about Frot, ck out What's Hot About Frot

Or visit our FAQs page.

Warriors Speak Home

Cockrub Warriors Site Guide

The Man2Man Alliance

Heroic Homosex

Frot Men


Frot Club

Personal Stories

| What's Hot About Frot | Hyacinthine Love | THE FIGHT | Kevin! | Cockrub Warriors of Mars | The Avenger | Antagony | TUFF GUYZ | Musings of a BGM into Frot | Warriors Speak | Ask Sensei Patrick | Warrior Fiction | Frot: The Next Sexual Revolution |
| Heroes Site Guide | Toward a New Concept of M2M | What Sex Is |In Search of an Heroic Friend | Masculinity and Spirit |
| Jocks and Cocks | Gilgamesh | The Greeks | Hoplites! | The Warrior Bond | Nude Combat | Phallic, Masculine, Heroic | Reading |
| Heroic Homosex Home | Cockrub Warriors Home | Heroes Home | Story of Bill and Brett Home | Frot Club Home |
| Definitions | FAQs | Join Us | Contact Us | Tell Your Story |

© All material on this site Copyright 2001 - 2010 by Bill Weintraub. All rights reserved.