Bill Weintraub

Re: never expressed feelings

7-3-2002

hey t dude

you're very welcome -- i'm glad the site has been helpful for you

guys, here's t's self-description from Frot Club -- he's in Kentucky:

i'm curious, pretty straight love sex w/females, but i want to do this

i'm 44 average-looking mildly muscular 160lbs 5' 8'' (5in) martial artist

need a safe/discreet friend 4 this

it's interesting to me that t does martial arts

of course we have a lot of guys on the site who are into combat sports, and most of you know Warrior Patrick's statement, "I never met a fighter who didn't like to frot."

i'll have more to say about combat sports, frot, and the warrior ethos later in the summer

Farmboy Warrior

Re: never expressed feelings

7-9-2002

T:

Your message resonated with me because I have felt alone too. But the more I hang around this great site the more I realize there are a lot of guys who want the freedom to experience m2m. I'm not really a big Barbra Streisand fan but she said something that rings true to me: "I'd like to do everything I can to avoid being an old person who says, 'Why didn't I do that? Why didn't I take that chance?'" Hang in there, brother.

Marc

Re: never expressed feelings

11-22-2002

I have lived fifty years with my "secret".

Although I had two frot-type relationships while in college, I have shunned my personal feelings for the thirty-three years of my marriage.

Like so many on your site, I love my wife dearly. I love my children.

But part of me is hollow.

Though I've shunned my personal feelings, I have had three "close encounters" which I never permitted to go any further.

I have always felt dirty because of my inner feelings. I grew up in an affluent family; I was one of those famous "golden boys".

The other night my wife and I made love, which has always been good for us ... very passionate, but tender. However, it awakened an old yearning in me.

For some reason, I went to the computer and stumbled across your site. As I began to read, I felt the old feelings of guilt and perversion wash over me.

Then I suddenly realized that the men I was reading about were like myself! I wasn't as bizzare as I had always thought!

I never considered myself "gay" because the thought of anal sex nauseated me. I never considered myself "straight" because because I was very attracted to certain guys ... especially those in tight jeans or swimsuits.

Through most of my married life, I rarely masterbated because it only aroused my feelings of guilt and disgust ... no matter how good it felt! When I would weaken and do so, I would always wear a pair of tight Speedo briefs in order to get off on myself.

I have never been attracted to obviously gay men. Only men who are men have ever appealed to me. Now I know why.

Your site has explained a lot to me about myself. For the first time in fifty years, I can really accept who I am.

Knowing the rest of you are out there has made all the difference!

I doubt I will ever have the relationship I dream about, but knowing that others do, makes me happy.

I have manifested the "golden boy" imagine of my youth. I am very visible in my community and have clients in many states.

Finding and enjoying a relationship would be very tricky for me ... as much as I would welcome it. However, I am not ready to risk the exposure (no pun intended). I live in area with a very large gay population. I have many gay clients. To have my personal life spill over into this arena could be disasterous.

Still, I think about two of the three "close encounters" I had in the past with regret. Both guys were much younger than I, and I could have loved them very much. In fact, I still do and think of them often.

Please respect my privacy since my computer is used by others. If you have a reply, I will be visiting your site on a regular basis. It makes me feel good to be in touch with men like myself. I no longer feel like a freak! For this fact, I thank from the bottom of my heart.

Sincerely,

Marc

Sir Robert

Re: never expressed feelings

11-24-2002

You're not alone in the world "T". Many of us thought ourselves alone until we found other men like us (straight acting) and/or stumbled upon this site. I think the feelings you speak of are pretty common among us here.

COCKRUB WARRIORS RULE !!!

Sir Robert

Sir Robert

Re: never expressed feelings

11-24-2002

Marc I am glad to see you express what you have expressed and I think it describes what many of us have felt. You are NOT a "freak"!! You're just one of US guys and that's great. We have all thought we were alone in our feelings and desires. We have all felt turned off by the "gay" routine because we REFUSE to sacrifice our manhood, masculinity, and self esteem. Great post Marc!!

Sir Robert

Marc

Re: never expressed feelings

11-24-2002

Thanks, Sir Robert. I appreciate your support. My only regret is that I've had to wait this long to find out about myself. Had I known what I know now, my life would have been very different. Oh, well ... I'm a firm believer in reincarnation so perhaps my next "go-round" will be more sexually fullfilling. Thanks again for your thoughts!

Marc

Sir Robert

Re: never expressed feelings

11-25-2002

LOL...hey brother I believe in reincarnation too and hopefully now that we have found our niche we wont forget it the next time we come into this world. I also think there are many of us in here that regret not finding ourselves earlier in our lives but we must focus on the NOW and enjoy the fact that we have now found ourselves as Cockrub Warriors.

Sir Robert

patrick and bill

Re: never expressed feelings

11-25-2002

yes marc and sir robert

but i hope too that some of you will feel the desire, and perhaps even a responsibility, to spread the word about frot

you need to be clear that what happened to you was the result of social forces, what some social theorists call "dominant paradigms" and what i call cultural tyrannies or dictatorships

the first of these was one we in Gay Lib termed in the early 70s "the Heterosexual Dictatorship," which proclaimed that only hetero sex was normal and healthy sex -- those indulging in homo sex, it said, were mentally ill

but the second is a dictatorship within a subculture, the gay male subculture, and i've called it, as disrespectfully as possible, the Butt Fuck Dictatorship or BFD

the BFD proclaims that for men who have sex with men, only anal penetration is normal and truly fulfilling

and, remarkably, in a subculture which claims to "honor diversity," the BFD also teaches that those who don't like anal are psychologically deficient

that re-adoption of a medical model of sexuality is a genuine betrayal of the principles of Gay Liberation without which today's overfed and smug gay male establishment would not exist, and it needs to be seen as such

So: there are literally millions of men out there who, as you did sir robert and marc, believe that their only choices are to be "str8" or to have anal sex

and *only you* -- and the other guys in the club -- can tell them otherwise

i'm just one person -- Bill Weintraub

i've spent two years building this site and, in the process, giving you a forum

and in the coming year, helped by Sensei Patrick, who's a terrific guy, i'll be doing all in my power to reach even more men

but Patrick and i can't do it alone

we need your help

i realize that we're attracting more and more married men to the site, and that those of you who are married are operating under a genuine constraint of not wanting to hurt your families and the women you love

nevertheless -- i've been a gay activist for 30 years, and i've lived through some pretty terrible times -- years of unabashed societal hatred of homosexuals, rampant anti-gay violence, AIDS, and the brutal death of my first lover

but i've kept going, and i've learned that no obstacle is truly insurmountable

we know that most men are bisexual, and that there are ways for men to express their same-sex affections safely, morally, and with their masculinity intact

help us speak that truth

Sir Robert

Re: never expressed feelings

11-27-2002

Thanks Patrick and Bill. You're right!! Most men ARE bisexual and I know that some (many?) are fearful of expressing their bisexuality because they think that it is "gay" or they fear the BFD. Frot offers men an alternative and a safe and non-self degrading way to express their bisexual aspect. I think frot enhances rather than destroys one's masculinity. By the way, I studied much Greco-Roman history in college and one of the things I recall reading was that some warriors would stab their enemies with their swords and as the enemy was dying they would anally penetrate him as an ULTIMATE ACT OF DEFEAT AND HUMILIATION to the dying enemy. Interesting because psychologically that is exactly what anal does to you still in our contemporary times!!

I have always felt a close connection throughout my life with Greco-Roman warrior cultures and that includes a strong connection with their spirituality. I have always wanted to step back in time and "rejoin" that culture. Life was far better then..LOL, seriously. We cannot step back in time BUT what we CAN do is resurrect the values and lifestyles of those ancient warrior cultures when C2C was honored and accepted as the norm. In so doing I think that many men would REGAIN their Phallic Sexual Pride. This site and what you two are trying to do herein, along with all of us Cockrub Warriors, is a step in that RIGHT direction!!

I for one know that you two cannot do it all alone. So, you have my support. How can I help? Spread the word?....Im already doing that and I love it because I get to see the looks on many a male face and those looks are ones of relief and SELF acceptance. I write a lot and also write a periodic newsletter which I send out over the net. One of my latest writings was about Manhood and some of the things you talk about on this site. More such writings are forthcoming because the "news" needs to get out. Many gay males are in psychospiritual bondage and their NEEDS to be LIBERATION. They need to know and realize that anal does not have to be and they they DON'T have to sacrifice their sense of self or their masculinity to engage in one of the highest spiritual acts, which is, M2M phallic mating.

I am already spreading the word. I am with you and so are many other Cockrub Warriors in here. To get help my Brothers all you have to do is ask and I dont think many in here would say "no".

What you are doing here is touching lives and there is no greater good than that because when you touch lives those lives often tend to change through realizations and greater enlightenments that it is OK to be MALE and to engage in FROT. HONOR then begins to replace self devaluation. Self acceptance then begins to replace self rejection.

Sir Robert

Brothers of the Heart

A Case of Rape

The Ultimate Defeat

We ARE Warriors

Also by Sensei Patrick:

Ask Sensei Patrick

A "Straight" Man's Epiphany

The Inquisitor

Wrestlin Around With My Budz